98R #448

Im talking about the engine. Ive read a few times of cr's of usdm and jdm integras.

If the usdm b18c5 is rated at 195 hp with a 10.6.1 cr? Why do the JDM b18c have the same cr and is rated around 180hp. The Jdm b18c Rspec has 11.1 cr. rated at 195/197hp.
I know Im not the only one who has seen this. Look at the new GTS celica its rated at 180 hp and it dynos 159-163 range? Whats going on? Have we been bamboozled, hoodwinked, robbed or just plain gypped? probably gypped

ThePunk

The ratings are flywheel, not WHP.
You need to account for drivetrain losses.

BDiddy

naw you are just thinkin too hard. We get a little less pow on both models because of stricter emisions caused by crappier gas octaines. 93 should be the minimum. It burns cleaner and then we can get the real motors. Running a JDM motor with 100+ octaine possibly produces about the same number of CFCs possibly just a few more than currently. Basically its becasue we have crappy gas here that we get crappy engines.

paul_573

The factory quotes the HP at the crank, hence the higher HP numbers. When guys dyno their cars, they measure the HP that is available at the wheels. Because of drivetrain friction (more moving parts) you are losing about 10-15% of the manufacturer's quoted HP. In reality the quoted HP is there, but at the crank and not at the wheels.

Hope this helps

Paul

b00st-0wnz

Cel GTS = No LSD.
ITR = LSD. More drivetrain loss.

And the manu ratings aren't usually right on.

Bert

I think the origonal poster's point was that a GT-S dynos about the same as a ITR when supposedly the ITR has 15 more fwhp.

I think part of the issue is many car companies underrate (or overrate) hp on some models so that when they come out with their sportier version they can exaggerate the difference between that and the lower trim level. Chevy seems to do this with the Z-28 vs SS, VW did it with the 1.8t vs VR6, Honda seemed to do it with the Si and GSR, Ford with Mustang Cobra vs GT... the list goes on and on. Point being advertised hp is about marketing and is not always accurate.

905_S2K

You ever consider that the GS-R uses lower lift cams on both the in. and ex. side than a type-r, it also has a smaller throttle body size, a different style intake manifold, the GS-R head has LESS CC's than the type-r, the type-r head also has a mild port 'n polish job where the injectors spray and GS-R does not. THe ECU may be programmed differently as well. That's why the JDM GS-R is rated at 180hp even though compression is at 10.6:1

98R #448

I know they rate them at flywheel hp. Someone said something about better gas. I think its still all B.S. How much drive train are we talking exactly. I know no 2 cars are alike but come on. Just say 2 stock gsr's for example. 1 has a aftermarket lsd the other doesnt. True one still might be stronger than the other but honestly, I dont think adding a lsd then dynoing a car is going to make it faster. It may help on a autox or dragstrip but I dont think the dyno cares.

Mugen-eg6 you make some good points but, I want to compare the usdm Itr and the jdm Itr both are pretty much quoted around the same hp 195-197. The gsr's on the other hand are quoted a 10hp difference.

I think I am starting to think too hard over nothing. Whats a few horse power anyway? Just another 14 sec car right?

905_S2K

true, but the only thing i can see a diff between the usdm and jdm GS-R is the raise in compression, and maybe the ECU is programmed differently. I doubt that the stock exhaust manifold on both cars are different. The better gas theory is B.S. IMO. I also somehow doubt that having an LSD will give you more drivetrain loss as well.

mugenracer

i have a JDm Si (GSR) and when i got it the engine was bone stock, i had it dyno'd before having the ECu remapped and it made 178.4bhp on the rollers using 98RON fuel. the ECu is set up to handle 100RON fuel in japan. My car also has a OE LSD, so therefore accounting for the lesser octane fuel, my car is making more or less the exact bhp as specified by the factory with no loss suffered from having the LSD

Rain_man

The better gas theory isn't theory; it's fact. The gas in Japan is higher octane and thus their cars can run higher compression. They also pay 4 dollars a gallon.

Also look at what happened when the LS went OBD II, it lost some horsepower and torque.


[Modified by Ein, 4:46 PM 1/29/2002]

Bert

I believe the Japanese octane rating is not directly comparable to the US octane rating since different formulas are used to derive them.

tooqwik1

THEY HAVE DIFF PROGRAM IN JAPAN ON THERE ECU ITS BETTER AND THEY HAVE BETTER ELEVATION FOR THERE ENGINES

98R #448

Better Elevation????

sgT

thats a new one

Reid

Yeah, that's why I lower all my cars as much as I can. At a lower elevation air is more dense so you make more power. The ITR is the lowest of all Integras and *gasp* makes the most power also. Coincidence? I think not...


[Modified by Reid, 11:52 AM 1/30/2002]

SamB

ROFL

Padawan

Hmm, I never thought of that. Time to get out the sawz-all and cut my springs.

EDIT - Better yet, I'll just take 'em out.


[Modified by SpecR0123, 6:21 PM 1/30/2002]

ITR764

ha ha!!!!

98R #448

ha ha ha . Im gonna take this as a misunderstanding. I hope tooquick meant something else like, cars will perform different under certain conditions like elevation, humidity, and temperature. its all good. I dont think anyone would really go out and cut their springs so thet could be fast and furious.