951junkiedc4

I'm think between ls vtec or gsr wit a b16 head wats best?

cmwalker

ls crank+gsr block+b16 head

dk=gsr

yep, and don't forget to remove the oil squitters if your planning to put a LS/B20 crank in a gsr.

GagnarTheUnruly

iTrader: (3)

Use whatever you have. And don't swap out the B18 head if you already have a GS-R.

951junkiedc4

I have. Ls motor but I'm not tryna change the piston and a friend is sellin me a jdm gsr block 4 400 with 50k on it but I'm not sure which on is faster...

GagnarTheUnruly

iTrader: (3)

bottom end work is required to run lsv safely and ls comp is too low for gsr cams anyways. so if you don't want to mess with pistons buy the jdm b18c. its better than usdm anyways

DirtyDA9

Keep the GSR bottom end stock, I wouldn't even touch it. Get a GSR head and build that. You will be much better off with that setup than an LSV.

B20ztek

iTrader: (1)

What this guy said.

Easier, less money, and probably more reliable, since you don't want to touch the bottom end

951junkiedc4

Y is the ls crank better? I don't mind swaping its just that pistons are like 200 bucks

Tight-R

A fully built ls-v will rock, but you're not doing that, therefore it's not better. Listen to these last few guys, not only do they make sense, but they can actually write a legitimate sentence. Believe it or not, some people are actually capable of that.

doood

iTrader: (1)

89mm stroke vs. gsr's 87.2mm

that's about it

DirtyDA9

Lol ^^ this, pretty much explains Honda-tech.

And what doood said is right. But I would just stick with a GSR crank in a GSR. The longer a stroke, the more and more it becomes out of balance as the (high) RPM's increase.

doood

iTrader: (1)

having the bottom end balanced takes care of that. the issue with long strokes and high rpm's is the piston speeds start getting insane.

just an example with rough figures here, since i dont care to look up the exact numbers....

a k24 with it's 99mm stroke revving at 7200rpm has the same piston speeds as a k20 with an 86mm stroke at 8000rpm

Dom93

gsr! lsv is too much to deal with! with lsv u can only do 7200-7400 revs without girdle, and if u mis shift ur screwed! you would ahve to buy a girdle and new mains and gsr main rods, then you would have to shave some off the mains or the girdle just to get it to fit the lsv and to safely rev to 8k+

not to mention you would have to replace the crappy ls pistons, water pump, oil pump and timing belt and buy all sorts of parts for the lsvtec conversion! (i wish i could go GSR right now but too late)..

go with the decision that better suits your needs! good luck!

GagnarTheUnruly

iTrader: (3)

LS-V is a great build if done right but if you already have a GS-R engine it's pointless. The main advantages are 1) if you already have an LS block and 2) LS blocks are cheap, so if you're going to rebuild from scratch you might as well start from there.

DirtyDA9

No you just need to get the mains and bolt holes align honed with the girdle. And an LSVTEC built right can rev over 8k safely, WITHOUT a girdle, no problem. Forged internals or just rod bolts, balanced rotating assembly.

Dom93

GagnarTheUnruly
i like your point of view very true!

DirtyDA9
and yeah i thought i would put in my knowledge, but i always like being corrected for things im not 100% sure of! im not even sure what my rpm rage i am suitable to go in my lsv.. not all of my internals are forged but so far ive built it right!

DirtyDA9

Lol I wasn't trying to be an ******* or anything, if it came off that way I'm sorry. Just letting him know that for a girdle the holes and MBC's need to be machined. And as long as you have ARP rod bolts, 8k+ is fine, especially if the rotating assembly was balanced. A forged internal LS bottom, with built VTEC head can hit 9-9.5k RPM's safely.

Dom93

no dude your okay, im just now learning about this stuff and i like great input! and yeah i get what your saying now, i just read different things and ways to do it! never knew you could safely hit 8k+ without girdle, make me feel more confident about my lsv lol! would it be alright if i sent u a pm of my lsv and i want to get your input on it if it is good for 8k+ revs!

and yeah i forgot about the machining part!

B18C5-EH2

I've NEVER been a friend of LS-VTEC...why?

Well Honda had the LS block in production 3 years before they DEVELOPED the B18C1 1.8L GS-R engine. You know Honda must have slapped a VTEC head on an LS block in hopes that it'd hold up to their standards. It obviously wasn't ideal, or why else would they spend millions of dollars on R&D, a destroked crank, adding oil squirters, etc.

If the LS block were even sufficient for VTEC duty Honda would ave simply worked with what they already had.

Also I have not seen anyone mention this, and maybe I missed it, but a B16A head on a stock GS-R block (with GS-R pistons in it) will LOWER COMPRESSION which is a bad idea.

GS-R head has smaller combustion chambers, so that's why it still has 10:1CR (10.6:1 in Japan) even with flat top GS-R pistons.

If you swap to a B16A head you will really want to swap to B16A pistons too. They have same bore, height, rings, etc. but have taller dome which yields more compression.

Also very importantly:

WHAT TRANSMISSION WILL YOU BE USING?

VTEC engine + LS tranny = megafail.

Tight-R

You do realize compression isn't a large factor (especially with your point) to how much power a car makes. 1 full compression point in an n/a 1.8ltr motor is worth ~10hp. There's specific calcs you can run, which I don't want to get in to for an exact number, but it's not a make it or break it situation. I don't agree with LS-V, but if it's done right, it rips. I like motors that haven't been taken apart though. Factory Honduh stuff makes plenty of power for this guy.

DirtyDA9

Yea no problem, please do.

DirtyDA9

I would like to think it's just that Honda engineers are smart enough to know what a good Rod to Stroke ratio is/does...

And you are right about the compression with a B16 vs GSR head, the GSR head, like you said, has smaller combustion chambers, better quench, and help to prevent detonation.

DirtyDA9

Another thing about B16 heads, there were so many B16/Type-r heads being mass-produced, that after a while the cast that they were being made in started to "shift" slightly, so once in a while you will come across a B16 head with sloppy casting (like overcast [slag], or slantedness).

JdmTypeRdc2

iTrader: (1)

Stick with the full GSR and build off that... You will thank yourself in the long run.